Product Directors at Snap Inc., founders of and Brothers Venture

Interview: Ljubov Dzuzhynska
Photo: Pavel Fedorov

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What’s it like to be you?
David: I think the answer is hidden in the question itself, or, rather, an anti-answer. We don’t really exist as individuals, meaning that we don’t really exist as separate individuals. We live most of our lives as two people.
Daniil: As one person.
David: How does it feel to be someone who lives life together? I think it’s great. Great in the sense of “different” and in the sense of “good.”
Daniil: We’d all like to live differently.
David: Yes. We’d all like to live differently. At some point, it was strange to some of our partners that we have the opportunity to be in two places at the same time doing meetings and managing time more efficiently, but instead, we were doing things together.
Daniil: We feel that at any meeting, everyone is for himself on the other side of the table, and the two of us as one person are a super person. Two people in one.
David: You can be funny and serious, you can be very thoughtful, follow, and pay attention to people’s emotions, and all of it at the same time.
Daniil: Someone might say that we are very different. But truth is, these are different qualities of the person we represent.

If you were a single organism (human) then who would be which part? But you can’t choose anything symmetrical.
Daniil: Symmetrical as in left arm and right arm?

Yes, that would be too easy.
Daniil: You know, there is a saying: “A crazed head does not allow the legs to rest“. So I am those restless legs, and David is the head.

You’re always together, yet do you ever get tired of each other?
David: We do get tired of each other. And when we do then it’s usually the end of the day and we just fall asleep. In the morning we wake up and are not tired of each other.

Is there an overload?
David: Probably, many people would call it that but I know that this is an answer to another question. We have rules in our relationship – we try to avoid arguing in front of strangers. Our arguments can look very, very harsh. There were instances when people who were not really familiar with us were present during our argument, and they left the meeting thinking that they have witnessed the end of the union of the Liberman brothers. They were sure that it was over. We have such disputes quite often.
Daniil: We can get tired of a specific conversation, a specific argument, a topic.
David: We reboot very fast. We just switch our attention to another topic, and it does not concern a person specifically.
Daniil:  Simply saying we do not get tired of each other because it is so interesting to be around one another that we don’t even know why be apart at all. 
David: I think there’s another aspect to it. 

We enrolled at university and found out that many of our fellow students said, “I want to be alone.” And it seemed to them that it was some sort of an obvious feeling, and that every person should have this feeling. Why do you want to be alone? What are you seeking that makes you want to be alone?

Daniil: We’ve taught ourselves that other people can have this feeling. They may want to be alone. And we give them that space.

Do you compromise? 
Daniil: We almost never compromise. In the usual sense of the word.
David: We always come to a common opinion in the end. Sometimes it takes years. Sometimes it is a very long journey in seeking the truth.

What have you learned from each other over the years?
Daniil: I learned to listen to people.
David: Again, it’s a question that pushes us into the ordinary. Learning from each other is a thing that one person learned, and then the other learned from him. Although we are evolving in terms of everything equally to each other. It is very difficult to say if any of my qualities are initially mine, or that you can learn from me. You’ve said that you learned to listen, but I learned to listen to myself and there were various practices associated with it. Therefore, you can’t really say that you’ve learned this from me. You might have learned this later than me. Or you keep learning, so it’s hard to say.
Daniil: Most of the things that we’ve learned in our life are because we have each other.

Who was or is your biggest teacher in life?
Daniil: It’s a crazy difficult question because we actually ask it all the time ourselves. How is it that people have someone like that, but we do not notice that. No, not true, of course, we notice. Our parents were great examples for us. After that, there were several teachers at school. Now, when we look back, we understand that what we learned from them is a tiny part of what we have become.
David: There is also an issue that very often, people ended up being our teachers not because they taught us something directly, but because at the end of a certain situation we endured and understood something for ourselves. This is a difficult question for us, especially since it seems to us that probably, for the last 10 years, it is already difficult to single out someone from the outer circle.

You have two camps at Burning Man, one of which is dedicated to personal stories.
David: The two are the same camp. These are two very different states of the same camp.

So in the realms of the camp that is dedicated to personal stories – are you tired of telling your personal story over and over again?
David: You know, there is a thing that we tell a lot of times and in this regard, it is one of the fastest ways in general to create deep relationships. Otherwise, you spend way more time and build mediocre connections. 
Daniil: Here’s the thing.

Do you get fed up by exercise in the morning if it makes your physical body better and healthier? It’s the same here. Our perception is that those who do not tell stories about themselves waste a lot of time on building relationships. Stories are the quickest way of understanding whether there is a relationship or not.

David: But on the other hand, we still sometimes tell our story to those “acquaintances” with whom we, perhaps, do not want to build deeper relationships. We’ve recently recorded a lot of videos. If you want to know more about us, you can just see those. It’s two different processes. On the one hand, if we just want someone to know something, then it’s easier to record a video. And if we want to create a deep relationship with someone – then telling each other’s stories has that power and plays a major role.

As kids, did you like fairy tales?
Daniil: We loved fairy tales.

Could you highlight your favorite fairy tale and explain why it was your favorite?
Daniil:  First of all, what are fairy tales? It’s important to clarify. Sometimes books for adults were read to us as fairy tales. Our mom read all of her favorite books to us when we were very young. Therefore, all those were fairy tales for us, and some of them were very scary. Even now we cannot remember what it was, but there was something very tense about those stories – the hard lives of young children who were tortured in one way or another.
David: Most often I think of “Moomins“.
Daniil: “Karlsson on the Roof“.
David: I think that “Moomins” because it’s about a family, a large family, with a mom and a dad, and they were dealing with some problems.
Daniil: But at the same time, Moomin-mom is the best mom, who never forbids anyone from anything. And does not promise anything to anyone.
David: I don’t know if that counts as a fairy tale, but it is what our mother read to us as fairy tales.
Daniil: We’ve heard all of the fairy tales. We loved fairy tales. We wrote our own fairy tales,  the two of us. The five youngest of six children. We grew up in the same room, six of us. We wrote fairy tales and staged performances of them and our actors were plush toys. We did that constantly.

Were these fantasy tales? Or were they more realistic in terms of the plot?
Daniil: Fantasy – magic, dragons, flights, space travel. Yet it was all realistic.

What film, book, or fairy tale would you like to be a part of? You don’t necessarily need to experience the fate of the main character.
Daniil: It’s funny, and I think this will be a negative example, but I’ve always been very interested in what I would do if I was in Groundhog Day. I think that it would be very interesting to spend a day like that. Although I am sure that I would get tired, just like any other person, in general… The essence of this film is that in the end, you will figure out how to get out of this cycle.
David: There are few films that have created worlds. The Matrix is a very interesting world. What other worlds are there?
Daniil: We haven’t filmed it yet.
David: Where Dreams May Come” is a very beautiful, interesting world. In terms of world creation, it was one of the most stunning films in which a world was created.
Daniil: The Game” – another world in which everything is a special game and you worry without understanding it. It’s an interesting experience.

About Groundhog Day: has there been a moment in your life that you would like to live over and over again without having a memory of it once the cycle starts anew?
Daniil: I remember.

Or is it still ahead of you, like the universe?
Daniil: The day when you live through the same thing, and then it all happens over and over again.

Like Faust wrote, “Linger, still linger, beautiful illusions.”
Daniil: It is very complex because the answer is rather no. But it can be a feeling because during our life we have experienced a lot of things, for which we are very grateful. But on the other hand, 

a long time ago, we decided that the goals that we set for ourselves are not that realistic and long-term. They were something that would happen in 20 years. We have always kept this bar for ourselves, for the past 20 years – that things will happen in 20 years. On the one hand, this helps you to be conscious and not lose your mind from the fact that you have unattainable goals in front of you. In fact, the goals that we set for ourselves for the next 20 years seem to be quite achievable. But, on the other hand, we came up with an interesting ‘star’ idea for ourselves that was created the very moment, in the exact world, the day that we want to live through 20 years from now – for it to be worth it. For all the other 20 years you live, realizing that you are just working for that day. And this day, it seems, is always ahead of you.

So I don’t have an answer to this. So probably – no. 

Like a dog running after a toy. 
Daniil: Yet we’ve created our own toy.

Back to the topic of worlds… What was the most beautiful thing you have ever seen, felt or lived through in your life?
Daniil: The most beautiful … Perhaps our dream-transformation. The first period of our life in which we are children who become religious young people who have a strong idea of ​​themselves, of the world, and this idea forms an entire life: morning, afternoon, evening, words, actions. After that, a rather abrupt phase, in which for over 20 years, a revolution occurs, a complete change and liberation from all the previous limitations that were put in front of you. This is not to say that we do not set frameworks for ourselves, because we are who we are, and in some aspects, we are changing. It is a choice we make over and over again, despite changing circumstances. And this change took place in the first year of university, or maybe a little earlier. The first year of university is the final change. One of the most interesting points.
David: We are very impressed by the beauty of some of the ideas that are born.
Daniil: That are born as a result of our conversations. Very often they are born during conversations with people.
David: The beauty of these ideas fills us immensely. And then this beauty delights us ideologically because you begin to see it in the world around you. We recently posted a video about copying. For us, it was one of the most insanely beautiful things.
Daniil: This was the second time when we changed and created freedom of thinking, completely liberated our thought process, and began to look for ways to expand it. And at that moment it was the moment of apprehending copy-ability. It opened a lot of things anew for us. 
David: The form of copy-ability is very beautiful because then you begin to see it everywhere: DNA, copy-ability of the birth of children, quantum coherence of particles as copy-ability. In this regard, I think that these are the ideas that allow you to see the world in an even more beautiful manner.


What excites you the most in your work and in all your projects?
David: It’s a combination of things. Firstly, these ideas are insanely inspiring: when you discover them and when you realize that they are new. You understand that through this prism the world can be perceived in a completely different way. This is very inspiring.
Daniil: You can not only see it, but also change it, interact with the world in a completely different way. Accordingly, these ideas change actions.
David: It is very inspiring when you imagine what the world looks like, which also apprehended these ideas. This picture of the world is very inspiring.
Daniil:  I know this can be a very harsh statement, but imagine a world in which everyone has already understood that killing is bad. You have to love your neighbor and so on. In fact, we have already achieved a lot and this is a wonderful world for people who looked at it 2 thousand years ago. It was very inspiring. Here and now, imagine a world in which people realize that we are now creating and understanding that this is a wonderful world. This is what inspires us.
David: And it is inspiring that you notice that in the past there were also ideas that were very much ahead of the curve and now you see how we do it so well. At some point, we, as humanity, had a thought and this also inspires, because you not only dream of changes in the future but see that they are already occurring.

The past, present and future are our source of inspiration.

Two questions in this regard. If everything starts with an idea, your project ends and the idea comes true, it materializes. What are your feelings after that? There is a phrase: “Nothing ruins the target like a direct hit.” Do you agree with it or not?
Daniil: To be honest, I think we radically disagree right now. We radically and fanatically disagree.

Why so?
Daniil: On the one hand, because we, unfortunately, or fortunately, do not see an endpoint to ideas and their development. In the sense that

our basic idea, which has changed our life quite a lot, is that “meanings constantly grow.” Creating new meaning is part of the law of the universe. The meaning of the universe lies in the fact that the meaning is constantly expanding and, accordingly, this game can be played endlessly. This is the same law of the universe as is gravity.

David: I think there are several options. The first is what we see in the example of people who have sought, for example, to experiment for 25 years of their lives. In the case of our parents, many of their achievements took 20-25 years. Modern people do not think with such ranges, and back then each discovery took 20-25 years.

That’s where your 20-year planning comes from – from your parents.
David: Yes, it is quite possible and quite accurate. But there were two factors. I can’t say that they were somehow upset when they did this experiment. On the contrary, you work on something for 20 years, after 20 years you are like, “Yes! I was right“. Excellent! Now moving forward. Another point is that it took them 25 years, and 10 years before this period ended, they already had the following theme. So they were looking for molecular computers inside a neuron, and while it was all being discovered, accepted by the scientific community, they had already started looking for a quantum computer inside a neuron. So I think we can expect the frontier to move.
Daniil: If it doesn’t move, then we will finally have a rest.
David: I don’t think it will be upsetting. Some people accidentally stumbled upon an idea, accidentally came into contact with it, so they may have a fear that the next one will not come. Some people have created one project in their lifetime, and then they suffer because they cannot create anything else.
Daniil: To be honest, I don’t think it’s an accident. Obviously, it is not. It is a coincidence because they do not see why and how they stumbled upon this idea.
David: Or they simply did not believe in this accident.
Daniil: And this accident frightened them. Fear limited their understanding of how they got there, and how to move forward to find it again and again.
David: The number of our ideas are just lining up.
Daniil: Once again

we love to interact with people and listen to their stories. That way we think about other people through other people. People have so many ideas. We can’t even begin to imagine that the stream of new ideas will ever end one day, because we continuously go through a constant flow of ideas by other people. 


We are not afraid that the flow of ideas will end. On the contrary, we are so looking forward to it.

Okay, then an abstract question. If you could travel in time, do you have any ideas that you would like to implement in the past or the future? It’s a phantasmagoric question. You have everything required to shift something in the past or to create something in the future and change or direct the course of history.
David: There are two aspects regarding the past. In the past, many things did not work most optimally and in the most beautiful way. And it might even be possible to make some of those transitions more beautiful. However, our reflection rather shows that many of these processes actually brought us to a better and better state. Even very terrible processes ultimately brought us, as humanity, to a better state. Therefore, I think that it is even very difficult to track, but was there something that needs to be changed? And I just really want to see the future.
Daniil: I would fly to the future in order to see what’s it going to be like when we are no longer there.

How far into the future?
David: Good question. Very far. You can only imagine the things that we would be able to do. 
Daniil:  Imagine if 5 thousand years ago it would be possible to imagine today’s world. It’s absolute magic. We move electrons by moving our fingers along the surface from which color radiates, and it depicts a picture for us, and we see people on the other side of the world, while talking to them.
David: I think that even though we can radically transform a lot in the next hundred years, it still seems that we will not even reach the stars and galaxies. We will be able to walk side by side, along a certain parallel line.
Daniil:  Everything can speed up. Everything can change. We still cannot afford to comprehend how I, how we, can be transported even to a neighboring galaxy. We are at a dead-end in this area. We can still fly to Mars, well, at best, to a nearby star. Although it is also not clear how.
David: Therefore, to look at the world in a couple of thousand years is very interesting. We try to do this at the expense of cinema, but, unfortunately, very often…
Daniil: We’re stuck in this box.
David: The current idea of how society works – and it just fits into the picture, so it’s usually not that interesting. But to imagine a completely different society in 1000 years is very fascinating.
Daniil: To look at it all, go back and live during our time, knowing how wonderful it will be for us in the future, – while having lived at least a year in the future.

Would you like to live forever to see that future?
David: To live forever… It’s a very interesting question. So you are asking if we would like to live forever regardless of the previous topic?
Daniil: We’ve always thought that it was meaningless thought before. What is there to think about? Whether you want to live forever, you don’t want to live forever, you live or you don’t live. And then at some point, you thought that as soon as you think about the potential for endless development of your own ideas, and not just about enjoying eternal life, then, probably, it makes sense to think about living forever.
David: The problem is that for us all ideas have a function and, unfortunately, now we are seeing what the idea of eternal life does to people. This creates more of a negative function than a positive one.
Daniil: Fear of not knowing the nothingness.
David: This fear is super uninteresting and people start to be extremely boring and dull.
Daniil: Very often people who want to live forever just don’t want to die.
David: At the same time, just one of the big discoveries around the idea of copying was the understanding that copied products have the property of concentration.
Daniil:  An example:

100 years ago, when a movie was shot, 20 people worked on it and it turned out to be one hour worth of film, and today the same hour of a film is created by 10 thousand people. And the concentration of the transferred experience through this picture today is incomparably greater than that which was a hundred years ago.


If you perceive life in terms of how much human labor one can consume, then in this regard, we already consume millions of lives.

It’s our typical breakfast: we get up, turn on the phone, turn on the computer. And the very thing that we are now experiencing and having the opportunity to experience it is impossible without the involvement of millions, and maybe billions of people. And in this regard, life also has such an aspect as concentration. Wee see concentration as an aspect that is more important than range.

If I can live billions of lives in 10 years, it’s better than living a hundred years that last as much.

And in this regard, we decided for ourselves that we will devote more effort to living a richer life, meaning that every second you try to live thousands and millions of lives, rather than lengthen the life that is so alike forever.
Daniil:  At the same time, we never stop at the thought that it is possible to live a very long, endless life.
David: Again, let people think about the concentration of life and live a long life rather than think about a long life. When you analyze an idea as a function, how it changes your behavior, how it changes your action, then the idea of a concentrated life seems more meaningful.
Daniil: It seems that if we still live forever, then we can imagine that we will turn into stars and travel through galaxies as meaningful light. Maybe this already exists. Let’s wait and see.


About time travel – if you had the opportunity to hear a personal story from any historical person, or even a fictional character, whose personal story would you like to hear?
David: A lot.
Daniil: There are many such stories. There are a few biblical ones that you should definitely listen to, but let’s combine them all into one. I would love to hear the stories of Abraham. Noah has a very interesting story.

What one question would you ask Noah?
David: Why was he disappointed? What came before the disappointment?

I haven’t read the Bible in a very long time and vaguely remember the details. What was he disappointed in?
David: There is a part of the Bible that everyone reads – ordinary consumers. And there is a part that is written for people who read it carefully. And it mentions that there are two different states of life. One state is that you live and you die.
Daniil: And the other- you walk under God, but God takes you away. There are people who are born and die, and there are people who are born, live under God and he then takes them away.
David: And the Bible only mentions a couple of people who lived this other way. The first was Enoch – Noah’s great-grandfather.
Daniil: Nothing is mentioned about him, except for the fact that he walked under God and God took him away.
David: The interesting thing is that you could hear many things in the culture that came from him, although nothing is known about him. For example, all the names of the archangels come from the book of Enoch, which no one has read. They are not mentioned anywhere else. If you watch anime or something like that then all these names come from, where the idea itself comes from, and they all come not from the Bible, but the Book of Enoch. In particular, a piece that was found not so long ago in the Qumran manuscripts.
Daniil: It doesn’t matter, the question was about disappointment. After the flood, Noah continues to live and dies. Before the flood, he was born and walks under God, and after the flood, he continues to live and dies.
David: It’s hard for all of us to understand what these words mean, but…
Daniil: But it is very interesting to at least understand what we do in our lives. Do we live and die, or do we walk under God? And if we don’t, wouldn’t it be interesting to walk under God?
David: In terms of other characters, there is definitely the incredible story of Jesus. It’s just very interesting to at least see everything that happens: the interweaving of the interests of history, how some actions originated in that period. If Jesus is not authorized for a conversation, then at least Judas. Of the key philosophers, scientists – there are some incredible stories from Newton.
Daniil: I would like to learn and fully hear all those incredible stories; how everything really happened and how he ended up with everything in general and what he went through – in the context of the time in which he lived.
David: Eleanor Roosevelt has a powerful story. She is perceived in relation to her husband, although her husband, most likely, was extremely unpleasant and even more, very likely – a fascist. And she was also a liberal who created the Charter of Human Rights, and so on. How living in the world of fascism and being the wife of one of the main fascists at that time, how did all these ideas blaze in her?
Daniil: The role of women in changing the world.
David: There must be an incredible story, judging by the feeling that it left in history.

Do you know that in the Bible before the 5th council of the church there was this thing as reincarnation? At the 5th Council, it was decided to remove it from all the texts and any mention of reincarnation was taken out.
Daniil: We can imagine that it was the case. The idea that the church has decided to remove what is inconvenient for us is not at all new and not surprising. Reincarnation – how could it not be? After all, we have stories of one person who started it all and who was reborn.
David: Again, when you start reading these existing passages of the books of Enoch or the Gospel of Judas, it becomes clear that they were thinking on a larger scale than they are now. From the point of view of religion, one must realize that there is a very superficial consumer ritual now. You have to shake something to feel something. Each person who is looking for something deeper still finds people who carry deeper knowledge. We are not very distracted by this ritual part, we are not interested in it because it has little content.
Daniil: We are completely open to different thinking in religious and non-religious terms…
Daniil: МSome things you can touch, some you cannot.


I really like the Quran in terms of how thought through it is. In fact, it is an ingenious instruction that cannot be changed. It mentions the fact that Muhammad is not a God, for he is a prophet. And the Koran is the words of God, which he transmitted through his prophet. But since the prophet is not a single one, there will be the next one. The end of the world will mark the appearance of a true prophet. That is, the next prophet may appear, and he will be able to make changes in the scriptures, but when he comes, the world will fall and changes will no longer be needed.
Daniil: The end of the world is the end of the world that I mentioned.

In life, there is the end of the past world and the beginning of the next world, when you only realize that everything you understood about yourself before was wrong and this is the end of the world for you. You then live a completely different life.

David: These texts have always been very charged and very interesting for us. We did not treat them with any disdain. Moreover, for us, more and more, these texts were still texts written by the prophets. And very often they were formed on the following aspect: “What was wrong with these prophets?”. The mistakes of these prophets and so on. And in this regard, it’s still sort of a distorted picture because it is broken by the consciousness of one prophet or another one.
Daniil: Through whom does knowledge pass into the texts of other people.
David: And in this regard, it is very important to see this refraction. It must be understood that this refraction was more due to the time at which it occurred. The refraction of time, even more, affects the context in which it happened.
Daniil: For what were they killed, for what they were not. But in the end, they were still killed.  
David: An example not from religion: there is a character who greatly influenced the world – Marx. I don’t know if you’ve read it or not.

‘Das Kapital’, of course.
David: Few have read it because it is very boring.
Daniil: More often than not, excerpts or opinions were read.
David: More and more people are reading Engels’ pages, but the first volumes of Capital are what Marx wrote. If you single out at least some political statement, yet rather there is none…
Daniil: It’s more of an analysis of economic philosophy: the state of the world before, now, and what it might be after.
David: And if you single out some political statement, then it would sound like this: “The standard working time should be reduced to 12 hours on weekdays, 8 hours on Saturday and Sunday should be a day off.” From what I said, it is immediately clear that this is some kind of nonsense. And in general, it is not clear what he writes about. He wants to increase the amount of work or something else. As soon as you look from the time now at the texts that are written concerning the time when they were written in, they may seem like absolute stupidity. And you may not see any innovation in it. But when everyone works 7 days a week, 14 hours a day, the 12 hour day looks like a super innovation and seems like an incredible breakthrough. The same thing with “7-day rest” – which worked in the world before the weekend happened, but now it looks silly too. We have two days off a week, and the idea of ​​only having to rest for one day seems silly to us. Rather, you need a third day off.
Daniil: Yet this

rest time is a vital thing. The Bible clearly indicates not only to rest but to disconnect from what you do on weekdays. This is an entirely different state of mind. It’s a form of meditation and re-thinking, a reflection. Something that allows you to move on, something that changes the idea of the world and allows you to develop further, rather than being locked in the need to somehow get yourself food and shelter.

David: In general, we’ve learned to take into account that many of the texts that we read, some of them will continue to be relevant, and some may refer to the time when the given consciousness that wrote this text existed. And considering that this time could strongly refract the feeling of this consciousness.
Daniil: On the other hand, maybe they were super enlightened people who created a message to people of their time. And so it was necessary to create a prism of time in any case. Or maybe they were the same people, but somehow they captured and grasped the most important idea that would make it possible to break humanity from the moment they appeared, from the moment they expressed this thought, they began to put it into the heads of other people and then it could no longer be stopped … It is already impossible to stop it because it has been said and it is already being refracted. Even the one who will try to stop it- this thought has already been reflected in him.
David: For us, this is another example that certain beautiful thoughts from the past have certainly influenced our future. So not to study these thoughts…
Daniil: Even if there is no God, yet the very idea of the existence of God has greatly influenced humanity.
David: Don’t dismiss all of these things from your worldview.

The idea of reincarnation has greatly influenced people. It made people think that every action has a consequence. It is indicated and it affects you.


A person who thinks about it is a more perfect being than one who does not. A person who thinks about it can achieve things that cannot be achieved by someone who does not think about it.

Daniil: Today we are flying into outer space because we thought about doing so.
David: As much as the church at some point tried to remove the idea of reincarnation, de facto, that almost every person knows what reincarnation is. The idea is difficult to stop, although someone at some point or another is still trying. More often than not, people who try to stop an idea, they end up being stuck in the past, forgotten, and unable to affect anything. They are seen as antagonists, as evil. There are where they belong. And ideas can hardly be prevented if they have a positive impact.
Daniil: Ourselves, we mostly think only about whether we will ever become people who will try to stop new ideas that will follow after us. It seems impossible to imagine.
David: A lot of people were like this in the past, so it’s hard to imagine.

Have you seen the film “Man From Earth”?
Daniil: Can you remind me of the plot?

It’s a story of a man who stopped aging 3 thousand years ago. The plot revolves around dialogues between a group of people. It would be very interesting for me to watch this film if you were a part of that group. Their dialogue would become way more interesting.
David: It would be incredibly interesting for us to make such a film about…
Daniil: About a different idea, about a different way of thinking that could advance and exist. Someday we will start making films.

What’s the most memorable question you’ve ever been asked in your life? Not necessarily in interviews, just in life. And why did it come to mind?
Daniil: I think one of those interesting questions was, “Why are you doing what you are doing?
David: Well, it’s a recurring question.
Daniil: It is probably the most interesting, because, at some point, we concluded what we are doing, what we are doing, because we would very much like to live in the world in which what we do is accomplished… I think this correlates with the question of what we would like to change in the future or the past: if we are put into this world in the future then how will we feel in it, from scratch, where no one knows us, where we have achieved nothing. If we were just thrown into it and how would we live in it.
David: One of the similar questions that made us go forward was the question, “Describe a city that lives by the policies of your ideas.” We sat for very long weeks, describing all the components: how the court works, how medicine works, the police. Everything was done completely from scratch in order to create one small city where everything works according to your system. It allowed us to concentrate.

How would you like to be remembered?
David: We would like to be remembered as the people who brought these ideas. We have no doubt that these ideas will be a big part of the future.
Daniil: As people who influenced their foundation. We ourselves are very ascetic of our role in these ideas.
David: If not, then it’s also good. But we’re talking about a ‘wishlist‘. 
Daniil: Then we would like to be remembered by people who influenced the fulfillment of these ideas, but also we understand that with or without us, this will happen because this is a natural course of events. It’s like imagining that at some point someone came up with mathematics, and in the end, this inevitably led to the emergence of computers, but it would take 3 thousand years or 5 thousand, but it would come to this anyway. In the same way, mathematics was impossible not to come up with.
David: Therefore, we treat ideas as something that does not really depend on us, but we are like little people through whom it influenced the world. We are very happy about it.

Translation: Elena Savlokhova